Bella's Pregnancy

[Amivera]

As far as the emphasis on beauty goes, I feel like while she does talk about it alot, she makes a point that beauty isn't the most important thing. That's why Bella isn't stereotypically drop-dead gorgeous.

Actually, SMeyer said that she made Bella very plain so that the readers could fit into her shoes. She didn't want to describe her too much. I also think a reason she didn't mention was because Bella *IS* Stephenie Meyer. She looks exactly like her, if you haven't noticed.

The focus on beauty is not in the drab dialogue, but in the flowery words themselves. When novels are analyzed, it's the syntax and the diction that is looked at intensely, because inside the words is the point.

The Twilight Catalog

References to Edward's Beauty: 165

Broken Down into the following categories -

* Face: 24 (Favorite adjectives: glorious, heavenly, seraphic)
* Voice: 20 (The voice of an archangel, donchaknow.)
* Eyes: 17
* Movement: 11
* Smile: 10
* Teeth: 8
* Muscles: 7
* Skin: 7 (Note: This only contains accounts of Edward's skin being beautiful. I didn't count references to it as "pale," "cold," or "white." If I had, this number would be about ten times larger.)
* Iron Strength or Limbs: 5
* Breath: 4 (EVEN HIS BREATH IS AMAZING.)
* Scent: 4
* Laughter: 3
* Handwriting: 2
* Chest: 2
* Driving Skills: 1

Where are the references to the beauty of his mind? Where are the references to his amazing education? Where is the "Oh my goodness, he has two degrees in medicine! He must be a smart, dedicated man that I would like to spend the rest of my life with!"?
Instead, it's, "Oh my goodness, his glowing topaz eyes are searing into my very soul, like hot embers lying on my naked chest, dissolving through the skin and melting into the very fabric of my heart."

You can purple prose it up, add flowery words on top and sprinkle it with sugar, but when you strip that away, you're left with two bare characters and a lot of fluff.

Sorry, off topic.

[BuffytheVampireLover]

In one of her interviews, she gave an incredibly detailed description of Bella. I agree, she is definitely SM to a certain degree. However, I disagree that it's all fluff. You can't say that looks mean nothing, because that's just naive; of course looks matter to a certain degree. I think the reason Bella goes on and on about Edward's beauty is because it's so new to her and she's shocked by it. Also, she doesn't know a whole lot about his background when she first meets him, so his education and worldly experience don't really factor in to how she feels about him. It's not always someone's resume that makes that worth your time. His beauty is something that, while it draws you in, it also is supposed to trigger your fear response. Her's doesn't trigger, and I think we can only assume it's because she sees something else in him that tells her not to be afraid. That's why she spouts off that list of reasons to Jacob for why she loves him. Why would she wish he weren't beautiful if that was the only reason she loved him?

spookybell: I apologize for my ridiculously long name, hehe, and I agree that Renesmee is just about the most charming character you'll ever read about. She must get that from her dad

[Amivera]

His beauty only seems to lower her own self esteem. Perhaps that's why she wishes he weren't beautiful— because then she would stop wishing she was.

I feel that half the books focus on physical descriptions. Bella is always going on and on about how ugly, plain, and unremarkable she is. She goes on and on about how beautiful Edward is until you feel that it's so deeply ingrained in your mind, you shan't ever stop thinking about him physically, which practically shoves those rose-colored glasses up your nose.

I agree that beauty is a large part of attraction. If you aren't physically attracted to a person, than there's no chemistry. However, to have it be such a large part of the attraction that one is completely focused on physical aspects of *everything*, is over the top.

Also, books are not about description completely. The plot is very important. Developing characters is very important. We know Edward has pale skin, topaz eyes, bronze hair, and is inhumanly beautiful. But to mention this 165 times (literally— no exaggeration), is just *Over. The. Top.*
----

On the topic of the pregnancy, didn't Edward rip Bella's stomach open with his teeth?
His venom would have come in contact with her open wound or blood and immediately begun her change, right?

[Spartan]

His beauty only seems to lower her own self esteem. Perhaps that's why she wishes he weren't beautiful— because then she would stop wishing she was.

I feel that half the books focus on physical descriptions. Bella is always going on and on about how ugly, plain, and unremarkable she is. She goes on and on about how beautiful Edward is until you feel that it's so deeply ingrained in your mind, you shan't ever stop thinking about him physically, which practically shoves those rose-colored glasses up your nose.

I agree that beauty is a large part of attraction. If you aren't physically attracted to a person, than there's no chemistry. However, to have it be such a large part of the attraction that one is completely focused on physical aspects of *everything*, is over the top.

Also, books are not about description completely. The plot is very important. Developing characters is very important. We know Edward has pale skin, topaz eyes, bronze hair, and is inhumanly beautiful. But to mention this 165 times (literally— no exaggeration), is just *Over. The. Top.*
----

On the topic of the pregnancy, didn't Edward rip Bella's stomach open with his teeth?
His venom would have come in contact with her open wound or blood and immediately begun her change, right?

Ok - first , if you consider how many scentences are in all the books then 165 mentions of how great Edward looks isn't actually that much, Also I think that there is a lot of reminders of how perfect he is to reinforce the fact that he is so much more powerful and basically better than Bella - It's easy when reading books to forget that a character isn't normal and is actually a massive rat or something ( : P ) so it's to remind us that Edward is pretty much a different species to us and the whole point of the books is about him not wanting to hurt her with his powers and about them as a couple trying to survive with such big differences. If we forgot that Edward was a vamp then it'd be a pointless story because they could hook up and that would be it ( but with normal human problems)

And about the venom thing - It says in the book that Bella was dying and Edward was worried that the venom wouldn't react fast enough, that's why as soon as Nessie was out he put venom in her heart, and in her extremities . So that each seperate area of venom would get to work at the same time and change her quicker. Therfore there was venom all through her body rendering the fact that she had some on her stomach before her heart useless because Edward got his venom in her really quick so the all the seperate venom processes started at around the same time.

Hope that answers your question.

[ChristinasHeadache]

On the topic of the pregnancy, didn't Edward rip Bella's stomach open with his teeth?
His venom would have come in contact with her open wound or blood and immediately begun her change, right?

No. Edward did not rip open her stomach with his teeth. Rosalie cut her open with a scalpel. After they kicked Rosalie out of the room Edward cut her the rest of the way (and while it doesn't specify how many cuts she had I imagined he cut her uterus at this time) and used his teeth to rip open the amniotic sac around Renesmee.

[BuffytheVampireLover]

In most books you're right, plot is extremely important. I feel like this book is driven by its plot. The love story between the two of them is what makes you want to keep reading. Spartan says it very well that in 400 page book, to refer to a combination of 15 different things 165 times is really quite small. If you counted how many times Bella worried about Renee, or the number of times she says Jacob is her best friend, it would probably outweigh the number of times she mentions Edward's chest or his laughter (which, to me, is more of a personality than a beauty thing). I also think that you are right in that his beauty is a hit on her self-esteem. That's another reason why she notices it so much. She feels so plain compared to him. If she didn't feel so plain, it wouldn't make the 362 times Edward tells her how wonderful she is so meaningful. I think it makes a great contrast between how you see yourself compared to how the person who loves you sees you. Edward and Bella each think that they are unworthy of the other's love. It's the dynamic of each trying to prove the other's worth that is part of what makes them so great. It would be boring if they were just like "You're awesome, I'm awesome, we're awesome together. Cool."

Side note, Rosalie cut her open? I didn't know that, I thought Edward just ripped her open with his teeth. I really need to read BD again, I feel like I missed a lot of smaller details.

[Amivera]

In most books you're right, plot is extremely important. I feel like this book is driven by its plot. The love story between the two of them is what makes you want to keep reading. Spartan says it very well that in 400 page book, to refer to a combination of 15 different things 165 times is really quite small.

Your point about how you perceive yourself versus how others perceive you is very interesting— well said.

The 165 references countdown was in Twilight, though, when she wasn't worrying about Renesmee or Jacob or the werewolves. I still believe that the number of times— at least once in three pages— it mentions Edward's dazzling looks is too much. Once, twice, three times is enough. His beauty is ingrained in our minds. If he brings up random facts about the early 1900's, details maybe, or even throws in some of his knowledge about medicine or who knows what else he's picked up, we could see how different he was and the book would seem less vain.

We'll just have to agree to disagree here, though, because we both seem to be reading it different ways. (And this is the wrong thread to discuss it in. )

Side note, Rosalie cut her open? I didn't know that, I thought Edward just ripped her open with his teeth. I really need to read BD again, I feel like I missed a lot of smaller details.

Yes, I think I remember that Rosalie started to cut her open with a scalpel? Edward ripped apart the uterus with his teeth, though... I was under the impression that somewhere along the line, his venom came in contact with her bleeding open wounds, which would cause her change.

He didn't change her *right* after the baby was out, though. She held Renesmee for a bit and then Renesmee bit her (haha). She kind of slumped down and Jacob thought she was dead and he gave her CPR and *then* Edward injected venom into her.

[BuffytheVampireLover]

Okay, that right there is why pregnancy scares me to death. That whole scene was ridiculous. Teeth and uterus should never go together in the same sentence. Ever. I did think it was funny that Renesmee bit her, lol.

Very well, a truce shall commence. I actually totally forgot this was the pregnancy thread. This doesn't belong here either, but what the heck: I dunno if you like Lord of the Rings, but they did a similar count thing for the movies. I'm not sure where it would be online anymore, but it's called The Ring Count. It's hilarious because you never notice some of these things til they point them out.

[ChristinasHeadache]

Quote from Breaking Dawn:
Rosalie’s hand came up with a scalpel.
“Let the morphine spread!” Edward shouted at her.
“There’s no time,” Rosalie hissed. “He’s dying!”
Her hand came down on Bella’s stomach, and vivid red spouted out from where
she pierced the skin. It was like a bucket being turned over, a faucet twisted to
full. Bella jerked, but didn’t scream. She was still choking.

(Edited out useless info for this point)

I heard the soft, wet sound of the scalpel across her stomach. More blood
dripping to the floor.
The next sound jolted through me, unexpected, terrifying. Like metal being
shredded apart. The sound brought back the fight in the clearing so many months
ago, the tearing sound of the newborns being ripped apart. I glanced over to see
Edward’s face pressed against the bulge. Vampire teeth—a surefire way to cut
through vampire skin.

This was during Jacob's POV. Edward made a cut and since Rosalie had already opened her abdomen, I believe this was him cutting the uterus. If he had ripped the uterus with his teeth it would not have made a metal screeching sound because it was the amniotic sac that was impenetrable like vampire skin not Bella's uterus.

[*TwilightIsMyDrug*]

Ok, on the old forums this question was all over it. First of all, let's remember we are talking about vampires, remember? secondly, technically after a male becomes a vampire, he dosn't change, as with any vampire. but before he is changed, he is constantly making sperm. and sperm can stay alive up to 48 or more hours (depending on temperature) outside the human body. and the sperm is trapped in edward. so. the temperature he maintains is cold enough to freeze them. and of course we all know that edward upheld his virtue so much as to where he would not...er, expell of it himself. so it's been there since 1918. when he was changed. when he and bella had sex it was warmed up enough to fertilize. and half v-half h thing. sperm is in a fluid. his sperm is human, more or less. but the fluid he makes is vampire venom. and since having sex doesn't interrupt the blood system, which is what is needed for the venom to change the human. bella was able to get pregnant.

but remember, this is my theory. and this is a FICTION story, as much as we want it to be true.

That's pretty insightful. Good job. Isn't it funny how we have to analyze fictional conception? I just can't help myself. When you're this much into a saga, you kinda want it explained...especially something as complicated as vampire/human conception! LOL!