Bella Swan Cullen

[tripfeldthemystic]

i recently read that many people consider the twilight series to be a mary sue. i can sort of see it, i guess. perfectly imperfect main character who everyone loves, and her faults are endearing. hm, what do you guys think?

I suppose I do consider Bella a mary-sue, somewhat. There are several traits that could characterize her as such... someone listed a bunch of them on a writer's forum somewhere, but here's my version.

To me, it seems that Bella is cast in a very beautiful, selfless light, all the time. Even if she's ACTING selfish, immature, or hard-headed, she's still portrayed as a martyr with a very mature mind. (Except in Jacob's POV. But he tends to call a lot of things stupid when he's frustrated with them, so that could just be his personality talking.) She's incredibly popular without doing anything, and apparently has no really extraordinary or overly likeable qualities - even though about five (5) guys want her. Note that three of these five guys really don't add anything to the integrity or development of the plot or characters.

It's also quite strange that when Bella meets Edward, she threatens to inadvertently destroy his life and his family, yet he... falls in love with her? What? And then she totally overpowers him, and within the course of a few weeks, they're hopelessly devoted. And he just happens to be a hot vampire whom no other girls (or guys) could have possibly gotten close to romantically.

Though Bella seems to have a variety of flaws, I agree that many of them only exist to make her look innocent or endearing; they don't actually add anything to the book or her character. While reading "Twilight", it kept crossing my mind that her clumsiness only made appearances when there was an opportunity for Edward to come to her rescue.

More than that, she's immune to things that no other human being has ever been immune to - again, without any particular cause. What makes her mind so inward-turned? What had she actually been through before Twilight began? Meh, lots of people go through what she's gone through. Probably more than one person in Forks High. Before New Moon (ie, before Jane and Aro), it could have been explained as something to do with being Edward's "singer." Otherwise, it seems like this immunity only exists to pique Edward's curiosity and set up his fascination with her.

Then, in Breaking Dawn, not only does she successfully have a half-vampire baby that could easily destroy her, but she's also the second human ever to do so and survive, and SM just sort of glossed over the newborn phase - when she should have been totally uncontrollable in trying to eat humans. Then she singlehandedly saves the whole coven, without any apparent effort.

Admittedly, though, I do like and even admire some of her traits. For instance, her strength as a character. She's willing to risk everything she has just to be in love and stay with Edward. That takes an enormous amount of courage. That's why I was disappointed with her in New Moon... her strength kind of went away when Edward did; she didn't even make an effort to pull through, when her behavior in Twilight appeals to the contrary. But that aside, even if she can be considered something of a mary-sue, she's definitely someone to look up to, in terms of determination and caring for other people.

Hey, this is fun! I haven't done this much character analysis since The Phoenix Requiem started.

[navarre]

Thought-provoking question, malaz! I wish I was going to be around to see all the responses, but I'll be gone for a couple of days.

Maybe the answer is because Bella had help--from Kate and the rest? A little guidance and direction? Kate might not have known it was even possible to improve her talent, and gradually came to understand it. Perhaps Bella's talent is more prominent than Kate's?

I think all of her training from Zafrina and Kate helped to speed her along in her development. Also, a point, there are those who just learn very quickly and Bella obviously was one of those who could, plus there could be something to say for offensive gifts(Kate's) and defensive gifts(Bella's). Mmmm, even though Benjamin had one heck of an defensive gift - I wonder how long it took him to develope his strength.
Points to ponder.

[fauna.fleura]

Lovely analysis, EdwardNJessi!

Amivera, I think a lot of the reason the boys were interested in Bella was that she was not the least threatening ... nor was she weird, scary, or embarassing. Their self-confidence would not take a hit by associating with someone as nice and friendly as Bella. (Her initial mental snottiness about the Forks HS students were a reflection of her shyness, lack of social experience, and history of zero peer relationships. By the second week she was friendly to everyone [see T pp. 38-39].) Self-esteem in high school can be an oxymoron; as far as the guys were concerned, Bella was safe, not bad looking, and wouldn't shoot them down cruely if she wasn't interested. That's heady stuff for the male ego!

I would appreciate a definition of "Mary-Sue." I have a general idea of what it means, but I think I may be missing some pieces.

This came from Wikipedia:
Mary Sue, sometimes shortened simply to Sue, is a pejorative term used to describe a fictional character who plays a major role in the plot and is particularly characterized by overly idealized and clichéd mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as wish-fulfillment fantasies for their authors. Perhaps the single underlying feature of all characters described as "Mary Sues" is that they are too ostentatious for the audience's taste, or that the author seems to favor the character too highly. The author may seem to push how exceptional and wonderful the "Mary Sue" character is on his or her audience, sometimes leading the audience to dislike or even resent the character fairly quickly; such a character could be described as an "author's pet".

i hate mary sues with a passion, especially when i'm reading fanfiction. so i find it strange that i was never able to pick up a hint of it when i was reading twilight. although i think that bella is obviously favored by the author and she's "perfectly imperfect", i agree that she's also genuine. and i know that if i had gotten the mary sue vibe i would have disliked her immediately, but i didn't and i don't.

i just thought it would be an interesting topic to bring up.

One thing that irritates me now when i think about and find interesting as well. Is, Kate needed a century to stregthen her power and have it capable of being all over her body. but it took bella less than a month to get to where she is -- this is when bella seems very perfect. her ability to master something very very quickly that is supposed to be very very complex.

i agree that some aspects of breaking dawn (such as this one) had me going, "whaaaat?" a lot of people said that the fourth book was like a badly-written fanfiction, and i think that these things may have had something to do with it.

Thought-provoking question, malaz! I wish I was going to be around to see all the responses, but I'll be gone for a couple of days.

Maybe the answer is because Bella had help--from Kate and the rest? A little guidance and direction? Kate might not have known it was even possible to improve her talent, and gradually came to understand it. Perhaps Bella's talent is more prominent than Kate's?

hm, definitely something to consider. kate had to teach herself, but bella was getting help (and she had incentive to work hard, poor edward!) from a few people in the group. i thought it was weird, though, that kate wasn't really surprised at how fast bella progressed. edward and everyone else agreed that she was doing exceptionally well with the training, but kate's just like "meh."

[tripfeldthemystic]

This came from Wikipedia:
Mary Sue, sometimes shortened simply to Sue, is a pejorative term used to describe a fictional character who plays a major role in the plot and is particularly characterized by overly idealized and clichéd mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as wish-fulfillment fantasies for their authors. Perhaps the single underlying feature of all characters described as "Mary Sues" is that they are too ostentatious for the audience's taste, or that the author seems to favor the character too highly. The author may seem to push how exceptional and wonderful the "Mary Sue" character is on his or her audience, sometimes leading the audience to dislike or even resent the character fairly quickly; such a character could be described as an "author's pet".

i hate mary sues with a passion, especially when i'm reading fanfiction. so i find it strange that i was never able to pick up a hint of it when i was reading twilight. although i think that bella is obviously favored by the author and she's "perfectly imperfect", i agree that she's also genuine. and i know that if i had gotten the mary sue vibe i would have disliked her immediately, but i didn't and i don't.

i just thought it would be an interesting topic to bring up.

Trouble is, mary-sueism can't be defined in just one way; it can apply in many different scenarios. I disagree with the wikipedia definition in several ways. Mary-sues do not have to be major characters, be clichéd, or even be idealized, but the author does often seem to expect the audience to like a mary-sue. (Like many other things, self-insertion is a characteristic but isn't absolute.) For me, a mary-sue is a character - not necessarily a main character - whose perception is equal to reality, and who is generally cast in a good light even if she screws something up, if she screws something up at all. This seems to go right along with Bella. She figures out that Edward's a vampire within days, and whenever she gets him upset or gets anyone else upset (which she rarely does because everyone is madly in love with her), she's forgiven in minutes. Even if she bungles something huge, no one can ever bear to stay mad at her. If someone isolates themselves from her and refuses to speak to her, they're doing it for her safety or because their family (coughcoughpack) obliged them to isolate themselves, not because they're upset with her. That's another characteristic of a sue. Everyone loves Bella.

Her PERSONAL enemies I'll list here; they consist of:

- Jessica. She hates Bella mostly out of jealousy.

- Lauren. Her reasons for disliking Bella are never adequately explored, but we assume it's jealousy.

- Rosalie, to an extent. She also disliked Bella out of jealousy, because she wished she was human again whereas Bella is prepared to throw all of it away to be a vampire (which Rose considered a cursed existence.)

For villains and anti-heroes, we have quite an impressive list - James, Victoria, the newborns, the Volturi, the whole merry bunch. But for people who actually dislike Bella personally? Three, none of whom ever disliked her for any reason aside from jealousy. And of course Bella never really returned their dislike - again, she watched passively as they hated her, the selfless, innocent martyr once more.

[Amivera]

This came from Wikipedia:
Mary Sue, sometimes shortened simply to Sue, is a pejorative term used to describe a fictional character who plays a major role in the plot and is particularly characterized by overly idealized and clichéd mannerisms, lacking noteworthy flaws, and primarily functioning as wish-fulfillment fantasies for their authors. Perhaps the single underlying feature of all characters described as "Mary Sues" is that they are too ostentatious for the audience's taste, or that the author seems to favor the character too highly. The author may seem to push how exceptional and wonderful the "Mary Sue" character is on his or her audience, sometimes leading the audience to dislike or even resent the character fairly quickly; such a character could be described as an "author's pet".

If we're going by this definition, then yes: Bella is a Mary-Sue. She fits the majority— maybe even all— of the qualities of Wiki's interpretation of a Mary-Sue.

I agree, tripfeldthemystic , that there are many definitions of Mary-Sue. I think Wiki's fits well for this one, but your definition of it also fits.

For villains and anti-heroes, we have quite an impressive list - James, Victoria, the newborns, the Volturi, the whole merry bunch. But for people who actually dislike Bella personally? Three, none of whom ever disliked her for any reason aside from jealousy. And of course Bella never really returned their dislike - again, she watched passively as they hated her, the selfless, innocent martyr once more.

Very true.

[pubesy]

it is funny that most hate BD, with people saying that it is a rushed badly written piece of fanfiction, where Steph broke her own fantasy rules inorder to sell more copies and please more fans.

It is funny because Breaking Dawn (well almost dawn) was written YEARS ago for her sister. before new moon and eclipse ever existed! The PUBLISHER wanted to keep the characters in school for a bit longer to keep in with the YA audience - to keep bella relatable.

So Bella was always going to have a vampire child, become a vampire, and save the day with her unique powers. The only thing different was the role Jacob played.

For me, i am torn. I like the book, but it is definately not my fav in the series. I LOVED up to the section where renesmee is seen, and the volturi is told about her. (I still like that section but not love - it moves too slow)

For me i relate it to a fairy tale - we all what to know what happens AFTER the damsel marries Prince charming, and what happens DURING the Happily ever after - however once a sequel is made (ie Cinderella 2 or The little mermaid 2) and it differs from our expectations, you kind of wish you never watched the sequel, so you could still fantasize about what YOU think should have happened

[Landiana]

it is funny that most hate BD, with people saying that it is a rushed badly written piece of fanfiction, where Steph broke her own fantasy rules inorder to sell more copies and please more fans.

It is funny because Breaking Dawn (well almost dawn) was written YEARS ago for her sister. before new moon and eclipse ever existed! The PUBLISHER wanted to keep the characters in school for a bit longer to keep in with the YA audience - to keep bella relatable.

So Bella was always going to have a vampire child, become a vampire, and save the day with her unique powers. The only thing different was the role Jacob played.

For me, i am torn. I like the book, but it is definately not my fav in the series. I LOVED up to the section where renesmee is seen, and the volturi is told about her. (I still like that section but not love - it moves too slow)

i agree with you (i have been thinking bout that when reading all of the trashing of BD that has been going on of late)

with the port angeles scene i agree i was confused that she just shrugged it off. i knwo someone who has been assaulted and it has been years and he is not over it yet. and being almost assaulted is the same. you think why did they chose you to assault. even if your are saved from the situation, and know how to handle your self to stop the situation there is still that question in your head, why me? but then no one really knows how they would handle a situation like that. i would like to think that i would be able to defend myself and get away that i the whole reason i do karate), but i dont know and i dont ever want to find out.
the thing with bella is, we see it from in her mind. she cant control how she thinks and sees people.

sorry if none of that makes sense

[pubesy]

the thing is, the whole "almost attacked" scene in port Angeles is almost a positive for bella. (in a very twisted way)

while some horrible things COULD have happened - they didn't. rather a positive experience was gained - a date with Edward, and to find out that he cared for her.

[Landiana]

i see what you mean. there is the positive of the date with edward, but she was almost assaulted. that shjould leave marks. you dont repress that sort of thing

[pubesy]

you kind of do. the human mind is a VERY strange thing. Repression is common for traumatic events. Especially if the danger was never actualized.

it is a coping mechanism.