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Amethyst1
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Amethyst1 » Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:25 pm

lioness rampant - i AM aknowledging what Edward hears. but all Edward told us through Jacob was that Rosalie's priority was the baby and that's it. all the other stuff were jacob's interpretations (key word: interpretation). (btw, nice to see you on!!)

and umm...holdingoutforjacob. oh wow. i find it interesting that you refuse to aknowledge that Jacob and Rosalie were neck and neck with their rudeness. and jacob was EVEN more vocal about it. certainly it's not verbal abuse. but no one has any "right" to be rude to someone. in this case both Rose and Jacob were taking it out on each other. and yeah, Rosalie has every right to be rude to him as jacob. but come on, can you look at this situation from all sides?

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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Lioness Rampant » Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:30 pm

malaz wrote:lioness rampant - i AM aknowledging what Edward hears. but all Edward told us through Jacob was that Rosalie's priority was the baby and that's it. all the other stuff were jacob's interpretations (key word: interpretation). (btw, nice to see you on!!)
"all Edward told us through Jacob was that Rosalie's prioritt was the baby and that's it." um--- isn't this what this whole conversation is ABOUT? is this what the whole debate is about??? thats all we need- clarified conveniently that simple statement!

oh- what is "all the other stuff" that Jake interpreted? in this case, the way Rose treated Jake and the way Jake treated Rose is all just Jacob's interpretations.


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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Amethyst1 » Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:36 pm

Lioness Rampant wrote:
malaz wrote:lioness rampant - i AM aknowledging what Edward hears. but all Edward told us through Jacob was that Rosalie's priority was the baby and that's it. all the other stuff were jacob's interpretations (key word: interpretation). (btw, nice to see you on!!)
"all Edward told us through Jacob was that Rosalie's prioritt was the baby and that's it." um--- isn't this what this whole conversation is ABOUT? is this what the whole debate is about??? thats all we need- clarified conveniently that simple statement!

oh- what is "all the other stuff" that Jake interpreted? in this case, the way Rose treated Jake and the way Jake treated Rose is all just Jacob's interpretations.


(btw, its nice to BE on! I love Thanksgiving break)
you guys seem to think i didn't know that. it's really unsettling because i mention it in EVERY post (rose's priorty was the baby rose's priority was the baby..) what i am discussing is and we seem to go around in circles. Rose DID care for bella.
and jacob is biased. his point of view is biased. period. that's what being biased is "a particular tendency or inclination, esp. one that prevents unprejudiced consideration of a question; prejudice" that sounds very familiar to me. Jacob is biased in the way he regards Rosalie. not her actions persicely. because her actions are done. but the way he precieves them and interprets them and the way he sees Rosalie as a whole is biased.

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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by holdingoutforjacob » Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:59 pm

oh malaz. rosalie started it. and i wasn't talking about her rudeness to jacob, i was talking in general. she was rude to carlisle and edward too. her rudeness to jacob IN THE BEGINNING was unwarranted, he was just the only one who fought back. i find it interesting that you are being so one-sided that you can't see around jacob's bias. i'm not entirely sure what you think his bias is affecting. i find it interesting that you are so one-sided in projecting my one-sidedness, just because i think you're wrong.
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Amethyst1 » Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:19 pm

i'd rather you didn't intimate that i am wrong. please, lets just discuss without telling me my opinion is wrong. i mean, for sure, i would be if was thinking something along the lines "rosalie was perfectly respectful to jacob and had no intention of not wanting the baby..."

yeah, and i remember your long post. she started it by "hissing" at him. interesting. it doesn't make sense to me, but i'll except it. anyways. we all know jacob didn't like Rosalie and he hated her from the beginning, even then, the fury was there and he was bound to take it out on her sooner or later. but that's not what i trying to discuss...

the only thing Rosalie said to Carlisle was that "we let you have your way before. we're not..." i don't remember the rest. i mean yeah, it was pretty disrespectful of her and she could have phrased it differently. there's always a better way to say stuff. and to Edward. i am not sure she actaully spoke to him. But her "apparent" desire for the baby proberly put him off. but tell me, how was she repeatedly rude to the two of them other than what i mentioned (if i mentioned any at all...)?

well, when you're biased, prejudiced. whatever you want to call it. you precieve the person in a very undesirable, repugnant way...

hmm, did you just admit you were one-sided?
well, i am not one-sided. if i was, i would be discussing your exact points but in defense of Rosalie. Why can't you aknowledge that Jacob was as rude as rosalie was rude? you can justify jacob's rudeness because well he's your favourite, but you can't justify Rosalie's. and again, if was one-sided, i wouldn't be justifying Jacob's rudeness either.

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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Lioness Rampant » Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:53 pm

malaz wrote: you guys seem to think i didn't know that. it's really unsettling because i mention it in EVERY post (rose's priorty was the baby rose's priority was the baby..) what i am discussing is and we seem to go around in circles. Rose DID care for bella.
and jacob is biased. his point of view is biased. period. that's what being biased is "a particular tendency or inclination, esp. one that prevents unprejudiced consideration of a question; prejudice" that sounds very familiar to me. Jacob is biased in the way he regards Rosalie. not her actions persicely. because her actions are done. but the way he precieves them and interprets them and the way he sees Rosalie as a whole is biased.
what evidence is there that Rose care for Bella?
Malaz. Jake is biased. we've established that. Bella is biased. we've established that. but what does it MATTER? Their opinions can color a situation a certain way, but either way, its the ACTIONS that we should look at, not the way anyone sees anything.
who cares what Jake thinks of Rose? who cares what Bella thinks of Rose? thats not what this is about. this is about ROSE and what WE think of Rose. and by looking at her actions- we can determine our different perspectives. personally, I don't admire of her actions in Breaking Dawn. I think that they are quite the opposit eof admirable.- but that is my opinion, whether Jake agrees or not. whether Bella agrees or not. whether Joe Blow agrees or not.

and both of you- holdingoutforjacob and malaz- why does it matter who started what or whose fault what was? I fail to see what relevance this has.
they both had major friction and I think that the conversation of who started what is spiraling downwards...
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by cascsiany » Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:11 pm

Lioness Rampant wrote:
malaz wrote: you guys seem to think i didn't know that. it's really unsettling because i mention it in EVERY post (rose's priorty was the baby rose's priority was the baby..) what i am discussing is and we seem to go around in circles. Rose DID care for bella.
and jacob is biased. his point of view is biased. period. that's what being biased is "a particular tendency or inclination, esp. one that prevents unprejudiced consideration of a question; prejudice" that sounds very familiar to me. Jacob is biased in the way he regards Rosalie. not her actions persicely. because her actions are done. but the way he precieves them and interprets them and the way he sees Rosalie as a whole is biased.
what evidence is there that Rose care for Bella?
Malaz. Jake is biased. we've established that. Bella is biased. we've established that. but what does it MATTER? Their opinions can color a situation a certain way, but either way, its the ACTIONS that we should look at, not the way anyone sees anything.
who cares what Jake thinks of Rose? who cares what Bella thinks of Rose? thats not what this is about. this is about ROSE and what WE think of Rose. and by looking at her actions- we can determine our different perspectives. personally, I don't admire of her actions in Breaking Dawn. I think that they are quite the opposit eof admirable.- but that is my opinion, whether Jake agrees or not. whether Bella agrees or not. whether Joe Blow agrees or not.

and both of you- holdingoutforjacob and malaz- why does it matter who started what or whose fault what was? I fail to see what relevance this has.
they both had major friction and I think that the conversation of who started what is spiraling downwards...
Actions can be interpreted different ways too. I'm not saying that they are always interpreted incorrectly but it is possible. Not only that but everyone has their own opinion.

Yes both Jacob and Rosalie had issues with each other, but isn't it possible that there is some fault on both their sides. Also obviously there is preconceived distain for each other.
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Lioness Rampant » Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:37 pm

cascsiany wrote: Actions can be interpreted different ways too. I'm not saying that they are always interpreted incorrectly but it is possible. Not only that but everyone has their own opinion.

Yes both Jacob and Rosalie had issues with each other, but isn't it possible that there is some fault on both their sides. Also obviously there is preconceived distain for each other.
I agree with your second point, but I have to reply to your first statement...

Actions are actions. we all know what Rose did. The fact that Joe Bob washes the dishes is a fact. whether Jane Doe was narrating or Billy Smith was- an action is hard to interpret unless the narrator is not present at the scene or just blatantly mistaken. then there is the aspect of Edward, of course. He was there to verify Jake's conclusions- which, I would like to point out, do no refer to Rose's actions but her intentions. that is a different matter.

you are certainly correct in your statement that actions can be misinterpreted. I just dont think that is entirely applicable to this situation...
and yes, everyone has their own opinions, which adds to the colorful complexity of life and intellect!
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by cascsiany » Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:53 pm

I don't have all the books in front of me so I can't adequately discuss Rose's actions in the later books. I am kinda going off of memory and since i don't have a vampire's memory i can't remember every little detail. When I get my books back i would love to discuss this further.
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Re: Rosalie Hale

Post by Lioness Rampant » Thu Nov 27, 2008 11:00 pm

I agree, I would love to discuss her character in more depth. I think that her role, whether we apprectiate or not, is one of the more complex and interesting roles of the series. I really think that we have had some dynamic converstaions about her previously, but less and less so now...
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