Edward Cullen #6

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una
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by una » Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:10 am

I think we are ready for a new topic as everyone seems satisfied and agree with Jazz Girl's eloquent response.

Back to my earlier question, do we want to remain movie spoiler free here for a week or two or just dive in and possibly discuss the differences between movie Edward and book Edward? Or does someone else have another question they would like to discuss regarding Edward?
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Esme echo
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Esme echo » Wed Nov 25, 2009 12:05 pm

I vote for putting it off. The movie, after all, is just a fan-fic of the book, and I would rather discuss the book than the actor's interpretation of it.
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Kachiti » Wed Nov 25, 2009 8:23 pm

Esme echo wrote:I vote for putting it off. The movie, after all, is just a fan-fic of the book, and I would rather discuss the book than the actor's interpretation of it.
I'm with Esme echo. Besides I'm waiting until it gets on dvd.
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by holdingoutforjacob » Wed Nov 25, 2009 10:05 pm

I know we're moving on, but I want to thank Jazz Girl for expressing so well her counter-argument.

Swedishskinjer - I want to just add to Jazz Girl's statement that what haters do is take that one action of Edward's - not allowing Bella to see Jacob - and base their entire premise upon that. This is from the perspective of someone who has been turned off to Edward since reading that, and of someone who thinks it is terribly wrong - it was NOT abuse. If you take any mistake in a relationship out of context you can call it abusive, and that's what Twilight haters do. I don't necessarily entirely agree with the way Jazz Girl sees the event, but I agree with her final conclusion - it was not abuse. Abuse is a pattern over time that is sustained. True, this continued over a few days (or maybe it was a week or two - I don't remember) but it ended. Twilight haters will always ignore that.
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by una » Thu Nov 26, 2009 1:40 pm

Thank you for the feedback guys (and I do agree, I enjoy how you call the movie a "fan-fict" of the book, which is what a screen play is...or more to the point, "the cliff notes" of the book).

Okay, in honor of Thanksgiving (for us in the States), what would you think Edward was most thankful for before meeting Bella, in Twilight, in New Moon, in Eclipse and finally in Breaking Dawn and then beyond? (I think for some Bella is obvious, so maybe say Bella, but then give a close second...)? Do not feel free to answer each one or you can discuss (if you have this point of view) that Edward was not thankful for anything until he met and accepted Bella as his mate...
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Asheleyo » Thu Nov 26, 2009 6:42 pm

Before he met Bella, I would say Edward was most thankful for Carlisle. Or you could generalize it to his family. But I think his biggest bond is to Carlisle, and then second to Alice. He truly does love his family.

After Twilight (as in at the end of the book), he'd probably be most thankful for Bella being alive and the help of his family in keeping her safe.

After New Moon, I think Edward would probably be thankful to Alice for having seen Bella jump, and thereby bringing them back together; or for Jacob keeping her safe while Victoria tried to get to Forks.

After Eclipse...hmmm...I'd really just have to stick with Bella because she finally gave a concrete "yes" to his proposal and gave in to Alice's wish for a wedding.

After Breaking Dawn, I think Edward would be feeling thankful for all his loved ones. Probably the most for Bella and Renesmee, and possibly Rosalie next for having fought so hard to keep Bella and his child alive and Alice for having given them their final victory and come back home safe. Though I think he would also be feeling quite grateful to the (HUGE) wolf pack for having given them such an edge in the stand-off against the Volturi.
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Jazz Girl » Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:36 pm

First, a hardy thanks to all of you for your kind words. I get extremely...passionate about that particular topic and it's nice to know that I am able to articulate my thoughts in a coherent way. So, thanks. :)

Hmmmmm.... Una, an interesting question, especially with the before angle. Before he met Bella, I would have to honestly say, I don't think Edward was thankful for anything. He appreciated the love and support of his family. But, there's a difference between appreciating something and being thankful for it, IMO. To me, feeling thankful for something means you are happy it happened, would want it to happen again. Edward was not happy in his life, and I think most certainly would not want to become a vampire if he had the choice. So I have to honestly say I don't think he was thankful for anything.

Once he met Bella, she changes his perspective on life. She gives him back things to appreciate. So, that being said, once that happens, I agree with AshleyO. After Twilight, he is beyond thankful that they got to Bella in time, that they were able to save her and bring her back. After New Moon, he is thankful that they were back together and that he had recovered from his serious bout with downright stupidity, and that Bella had survived it as well. Also, I think his gratitude to Jake cannot be overstated. I have heard some discount his words to Jake in the woods, know people who think that he was just trying to make Jake look bad. I don't believe that in the least. I think Edward was truly grateful to Jake, and was overwhelmingly sincere in his thanks to him, when he thanked Jake for keeping Bella alive.

After Eclipse, I think he was grateful that the whole family came through the fight, I think he was grateful that Bella was safe and sound and said yes, and again, I think he was grateful to Jake as well. Regardless of how irritated he was with Jake, he and his pack were invaluable in protecting Bella and winning the battle against the newborns. But, also and more importantly, once Bella has really faced the idea of her choice, has tested what she and Edward have, I think it is easier for Edward to move forward and to accept a little easier the idea of changing her. And, I think, deep down, he is grateful to Jake for that. Granted, he still pretty much hates him and wants to tear him apart. But, he's still grateful

As for Breaking Dawn, he is grateful for all the gifts he has, and all the things he never knew to ask for. I think for the first time, he is grateful for the immortal life he has, because he has someone by his side who makes it worth living.
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Jazz Girl » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:30 pm

Ok....

So, I think we've sufficiently passed the amount of time to discuss movie Edward vs novel Edward has passed....

Something occurred to me while watching the film today.

In book Volterra, in that moment when Aro tries to read Bella's thoughts, the look on Edward's face is described as "smug" and that's all we really see of him in that moment. In film Volterra, in the same moment, there seems to be a little... wistfulness... on Edward's face. That got me to thinking... That was, at that time anyways, Edward's one and only shot at getting a glimpse into Bella's mind, given that he could be reading her thoughts through Aro's if it worked.

It made me think. Do you think Edward was disappointed that he did not get that brief glimpse into Bella's thoughts? What might his reaction have been?
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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by swedishskinjer » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:16 pm

Jazz Girl:

I'm not exactly sure if Edward could have handled reading Bella's thoughts for two different reasons:

1) It was a tense situation, so why would he want to make matters worse by succumbing to desire and reading Bella's mind without properly asking for her permission? Edward is far too polite to intrude during any emotionally intense moment. I'm sure that he would want his first "experience" with Bella's mind to be more intimate and private.

2) Aro and Edward are both able to read minds, yes, but Aro's ability is infinitely more potent in that he is able to have access to any thought in your lifetime. I've always wondered how he chooses a specific thought to see after making contact. Does he view many things at once before focusing on a specific time? Imagine how overwhelmed Edward would be if he attempted to tap into the mind of a superior immortal without knowing how to handle the immense amount of thoughts. It could potentially break his mind, since he's only accustomed to reading them on a much smaller scale.

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Re: Edward Cullen #6

Post by Jazz Girl » Sat Dec 12, 2009 12:13 am

swedishskinjer wrote:Jazz Girl:

I'm not exactly sure if Edward could have handled reading Bella's thoughts for two different reasons:

1) It was a tense situation, so why would he want to make matters worse by succumbing to desire and reading Bella's mind without properly asking for her permission? Edward is far too polite to intrude during any emotionally intense moment. I'm sure that he would want his first "experience" with Bella's mind to be more intimate and private.

2) Aro and Edward are both able to read minds, yes, but Aro's ability is infinitely more potent in that he is able to have access to any thought in your lifetime. I've always wondered how he chooses a specific thought to see after making contact. Does he view many things at once before focusing on a specific time? Imagine how overwhelmed Edward would be if he attempted to tap into the mind of a superior immortal without knowing how to handle the immense amount of thoughts. It could potentially break his mind, since he's only accustomed to reading them on a much smaller scale.

Hmmmm, interesting points, both. However, as we know from both Twilight and Dark High Noon, Edward does not have control over whether or not he hears someone's thoughts. He has learned to tune out certain voices over the years, out of respect for his family. However, as he says, it's like being in a noisy room where 1000 voices are buzzing in the background. Some voices come through clearer because of how attuned to them he is. Also, there are only a few people in the room at the moment, all of whom he is trying to focus on to have the most information possible so he can save Bella and get them the hell out. And, in this case, he woudl be listening most intently to Aro anyways as he is the one who will make that call and he is the one closest to Bella, the biggest threat to her in that moment.

As to Aro, I don't know that I would necessarily agree that he is a superior immortal to Edward, just that his power works differently. Yes, he can seee every thought where Edward can only see what you are thinking in that moment. But, conversely, he must have physical contact where Edward does not, giving him an advantage in many situations. After all, it is Aro who covets Edward's powers, not vice versa. And, we know that vampires in general can process so many more things at once than we can. Surely, it woudl be maybe overwhelming for Edward, but I don't think at all that it would break him.

Which brings us back to the original question...
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