Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Discussion of the Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn 1

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Emmettroselover
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Emmettroselover » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:11 pm

Even though I understand the whole, it is not real idea, readers dive into stories, especially of fiction and fantasy to try to connect with a world that in their minds could happen if certain elements did exist. That is why even when people know they are reading or watching something that is not real, they still might say it is not realistic. The writer is trying to sell you on this world to make you want more and buy into it. That cannot happen if it seems completely far fetched and ridiculous. That is why people get so invested in the characters and the plot and get so upset when something seems off or handled in the wrong way. For me, it is not as much about the imprinting as it is about how it was done. The way Jacob acted toward Renesmee and how he behaved is what seemed odd to me. I think it could have been handled a bit better....especially since the love triangle was still so fresh.....and a lot of fans seem to feel the same, which is why the share comment is such a cringe worthy moment to a lot of readers.

Also, the "it is not real" thing can be used for every part of the saga, but it does not stop us from talking about it, falling in love with the characters, and analyzing them, so why should the imprinting be any different? Yes, it is a fantasy story with fantasy elements, but SM kept so many of the supernatural elements close to human nature.....how the Cullens tried to blend in, how the pack saw themselves more as people than creatures....that there was a sense of it being a realistic world that "could" exist in our minds without us having to try to wrap our minds around it too much. Then, she tossed in the imprinting and it was hard to relate to unlike the other parts were. I do not think anyone can relate feeling such a connection with a child or knowing once they are born that they are going to be yours forever with the end result being a romantic one. It is not just that it is hard to comprehend, unlike other supernatural elements of the story, but also the execution. I have read a lot of stories where some pretty out there ideas are introduced but because the writer explains it and makes it happen in a certain way, it feels right for the story. I love the saga, but SM seemed to have trouble getting some of her points across very well in BD because it has become such a controversial book, I think the most controversial out of the four IMO. For this reason, I agree that no matter how Summit handles it, someone will be disappointed just like some were disappointed with the book.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Tornado » Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:43 pm

I guess it's all in the way we view it. It worked for me, like it was just another part of the magic of this fantasy world. I was really surprised when I realised a lot of fans had a problem with it, although it's certainly understandable. So I really hope Summit are careful in dealing with it. Roll on November!
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Chernaudi » Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:57 pm

I do feel that there has to be a time and a place where we all as fans sort of have to have a disconnect. We can fall in love with the story, and analyze it, but I do feel that a healthy approach is to realize in the back of our mind, that this isn't real, no matter how much we sometimes wish it was. :)

But the issue here is that Stephanie has taken things that can happen to anyone in their life, yet has given them a supernatural spin. Love triangles are real, but what are the chances that a woman can fall in love with a vampire or a werewolf/shape-shifter? A metaphor for one who falls in love with two people who come from the opposite side of the tracks and are polar opposites, and hence are automatic rivals?

That's sort of where I think a disconnect is needed, because it's a realistic situation that if anything could use a bit more of the supernatural thrown in, maybe.

Summit really needs to handle some of these elements with care, because the chances of success, failure, or total ineffectiveness can swing on a few details.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Tornado » Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:30 am

Yes, it's interesting to speculate on how they will deal with it. Will they brush over it quickly, hoping that no one will notice it, or will they bring it front and centre and make it a feature of the movie? I guess we'll find out in about 80 days!
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by RebeccaCullen » Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:22 am

Yeah, the series is fantasy and can't actually happen, but some thing's like Jacob imprinting on a newborn baby totally pulls me out of the world the story is set in, especially because of what SM was trying to sell in the book prior to it and how she handled the relationship's after he imprinted. He had no boundaries when it came to Renesmee and there was no scenes between Edward, Bella and their daughter without him, their family or other vampires present to satisfy my want to see the three of them acting as a family of their own. I find it hard to believe that Renesmee is to eventually see Jacob as a romantic interest with how he was presented in the books when it came to Renesmee and Bella. To me, he was more of a father figure than Edward because of the lack of boundaries that were given to him, and because SM failed to have Edward present and acting like Renesmee's dad.

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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Tornado » Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:37 am

Jacob a father figure because he had no boundaries? I have to disagree with that. I don't think he came across as a father figure at all. The only thing that could vaguely be taken that way was the concern he showed over her rapid growth and his terse questions to Carlisle, and even that didn't show the maturity you'd expect of a father figure. He was more like a chum, which is what he should have been to her at that stage.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by RebeccaCullen » Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:05 am

I keep forgetting that not everything that comes up at another forum I go to comes up over here. There was this Team Jacob fan that said, among other things I thought was utterly ridiculous (some of which is about what she thought BD shoulda been about), that Bella saw Edward as some sort of father figure because Charlie and to an extent Renee hadn`t acted like a real parents to her.

IMO, Jacob did feel like he was more of a father figure than cool best friend because of how much time was spent on his relationship with Renesmee and how much time was spent with him seemingly raising Renesmee with Bella (like taking the girl to Charlie`s while Bella went to Seattle and hunting). I never got the feeling that there were boundries set for him like there was with Quil and Claire, I mean, Jacob gave Renesmee a promise bracelet for Christmas and she looked like she was like three. I might be wrong on this assessment because I refuse to read BD again after I tried to a while back and couldn`t get more then a few pages in but that`s honestly the vibe I got from Jacob and Renesmee`s relationship when I did read it.

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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by Tornado » Tue Aug 30, 2011 6:11 am

I agree that there weren't too many boundaries set, but that doesn't equate him as being a father figure in my mind. Even with him being left at Charlie's with her and going hunting with them, that's more like a brother or pal (especially when it comes to their hunting contest) than father or lover.

A few of the things Jacob does is like what Quil was doing with Claire. When Jacob comes across them at the beginning of his part of BD, Quil is alone with Claire on the beach, finding little pebbles for her. No one else is with them. He is happily playing babysitter with her, without her parents around. They're apparently okay with that, too. This is very much like Jake being left with Renesmee at Charlie's while Bella goes to see J Jenks, so there are similarities in the way these two are behaving towards their young imprintees.

I do wonder about what Claire's parents think about Quil's relationship with their daughter. Do they know about imprinting? Probably not. How are they going to react when the man who has been like a brother to Claire throughout her childhood becomes her lover? At least Edward and Bella know about the imprinting. I think Quil's imprinting is a bit more creepy because of this element.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by RebeccaCullen » Tue Aug 30, 2011 6:58 am

Tornado wrote:I agree that there weren't too many boundaries set, but that doesn't equate him as being a father figure in my mind.
To each their own I guess.
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Re: Worried about Breaking Dawn?

Post by GrayceM » Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:39 am

Tornado wrote:I do wonder about what Claire's parents think about Quil's relationship with their daughter. Do they know about imprinting? Probably not. How are they going to react when the man who has been like a brother to Claire throughout her childhood becomes her lover? At least Edward and Bella know about the imprinting. I think Quil's imprinting is a bit more creepy because of this element.
Claire was Emily's neice, she was also Leah and Seth's cousin. I think there's only mention of her mother but it doesn't say who she is. I'd have to look through the guide again to see if it's in there. With her being Emily's neice, Seth and Leah's cousin, she'd also be a neice to Sue and Harry. In fact, in looking at family trees, I think most of the wolf pack are related. Paul and Sam are cousins though there's no mention of who Paul's parents are/were; Jared, Colin and Jacob are cousins on the Black's side; and Quil and Jacob are cousins on Jacob's mother's side. Seth and Leah are cousins also to Sam and Brady, and Paul. I think Embry was the only one not related but his father is one of the three: Billy Black, Quil Ateara IV, or Joshua Uley. If I remember correctly, he's the only one in the tribe who's parent didn't know about the shape-shifting.
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